Number Two
May 11, 2007
This morning Noah and I played our game of Gimme Kisses. I tell him to gimme kisses, please. He shakes his head no, and then I swoop in for a kiss anyway, while making a big, exaggerated mmmmmmmmmmmmmMWA sound. Then he giggles.
This morning I stopped playing after a few kisses. He started humming. "Mmmmmm." He reached up and put his hands on my cheeks and leaned in.
"MWA!" he shrieked, covering my face with kisses. Then we both giggled.
Yeah. I gotta get me another one of these.
***
Two things I said I'd never do again:
1) Have another child.
2) Take Clomid.
They went together pretty nicely, I thought.
But like a lot things I swore I'd never do (suburbs! yard! skinny jeans! hotdogs for lunch!), I changed my mind about Number One. I want another baby. WE want another baby.
The five of you who read the ClubMom blog know that Jason and I have been trying for awhile now. I don't know how long, exactly. Maybe since Noah's first birthday? Maybe even before that? I seem to remember using the BlogHer swag bag condom at some point, but honestly, we've never really used birth control since Noah was born.
"It wouldn't be the worst thing in the world," Jason said once about a second pregnancy, while I pondered the calendar in a minor morning-after freakout and looked at him, like THAT'S BITCH-CRAZY TALK, HELL YES IT WOULD BE, OUR CHILD STILL HAS POOPS THAT SHOOT PAST HIS NECK.
But then I gradually came around to his way of thinking. No, it wouldn't be the worst thing in the world. In a lot of ways it would be pretty great.
***
Which brings us to rethinking Thing Number Two. Stupid Number Two.
The 10 of you who have been reading all along might remember that I took Clomid for a few months with no success, waaay back in 2004. Those were pretty much the most miserable months of my life and I went completely batshit crazy afterwards, with depression and panic and I was just all around a Big Hot Mess. (I can't even bring myself to link to the entries from that time, even though they don't even begin to really express just how bad things got.)
I'm not sure if I've ever really spelled out my fertility issues here, so for those just joining us: I am annovulatory. I do not ovulate on my own, ever. I get periods -- usually every 45 to 50 days, but sometimes much more infrequent. In 2001 (2002? god, am senile. where the fuck are my keys?) I got two periods for the entire year.
We don't really know why -- I don't have PCOS or thyroid problems. I had an eating disorder all through high school, but I'd already had irregular periods for a few years before my anorexia developed. So I float around in the pool of Unexplained Infertility, watching my cycles get longer and more whacked out by the month. It's not insurmountable and it's not the end of the world -- but it's enough to color and complicate your reproductive plans.
After upping the dose of Clomid a couple times, I managed to ovulate, but didn't conceive. Then I got sick and we decided to take some time off from the baby-making and try again in the new year.
Then, of course, I fucking got pregnant. Like a normal human being, without Clomid or an IUI or even a damn thermometer. (The people who told me it was because I "just relaxed" are all buried under the floorboards of our old condo, thankyouverymuch.)
That pretty much brings us to now. I hoped that having Noah would "fix" everything. Like he was this 9-pound, 15-ounce Post-It Note that said HEY LOOK! WAY TO GO ON THE FULFILLING OF YOUR PRIMARY PURPOSE, OVARIES!
But no, everything is the same as it has always been. Which means we have two options:
1) Wait and see if we get lucky again.
2) Try Clomid again.
Stupid Number Two.
***
I don't know what option we're going to go with, honestly. On the one hand, I'm sick of thinking about this and marking tiny yet ultimately useless X's on the calendar. I'm sick of wondering if we'll get lucky next month or next year or ever.
On the other hand, I don't necessarily feel ready right this second to have another baby. Sometimes I still feel like I just HAD a baby. That I still HAVE a baby. That it's too soon and too much and maybe we should just let it happen when it's meant to happen, like Jason always said pre-Noah, and it pisses me off that he was right because I don't necessarily believe that things always happen when they're "meant" to happen, I mean, look at every reality TV show in the history of reality TV shows where my favorite contestant got voted off too soon.
On the other hand, Jason and I are both much, MUCH younger than our siblings. In a lot of ways we were only children. Which wasn't bad at all, oh no, but...I don't know. I think I'd enjoy watching Noah grow up with a sibling close to his age and wonder if we shouldn't get a little aggressive before too much time passes. I worry he'll be spoiled or lonely on his own, blah blah typical family planning mindfuck.
On the other hand, Clomid made me crazy.
I wonder if it would be as bad this time, since maybe I would be (shut up) more relaxed, since I have Noah and the knowledge that I CAN get pregnant and CAN carry to term, and honestly, I don't necessarily feel like not having a second child would be any big devastating thing. I mean, we want one, but if you told me tomorrow that our family was complete as-is I'd still feel pretty damn lucky and content.
On the other hand, I might only think that because deep down, I'm secretly pretty smug and confident that we'll be able to have a second baby eventually.
On the other hand, I am fresh out of other hands. I'm talking in circles and boring even myself. And I find myself pretty fascinating. Look! My belly button is squishy.
***
I look at his face and know that he is enough. He is more than enough. And yet because he is enough, more than enough, to fill my heart and life with such mind-boggling amounts of joy, I cannot help but wonder what it must be like to have that joy times two.
I cannot help but to take his face in my hands and cover it with kisses, while silently praying gimme baby. Please.
Good luck Amy, with whatever you decide. And if things don't seem to be working out/Clomid makes you too crazy, you can always adopt. And since you already have one bio kid you won't have the problem that my husband and I do--where everyone looks at us...looks at our kids and then asks "maybe they couldn't have any?!" "how sad!"
Bossy thinks you should give it some breathing room because Noah still has plenty of time to acquire a sibling and still feel as though they were always there.
Stopped by to say Happy Mother's Day!
I have hypothalamic amenorrhea, which might or might not be what's behind your anovulation -- my brain just doesn't get that it's supposed to send wake-up calls to my ovaries. I did one cycle each of Clomid and Femara, neither of which resulted in ovulation. The Femara wasn't so bad, but the Clomid was kind of evil. Neither drug tends to work very well if your problem lies in the brain (rather than, say, PCOS), so after trying each of them once, we quit dorking around and went straight to the hard stuff. We planned to do one "test" cycle of injectibles + IUI before moving on to IVF, but we got lucky on that first cycle, and my twin girls are eight months old.
I will second everyone above who says 1) find yourself a new RE; 2) try Femara; 3) consider injectibles. There is no reason why you have to do cycle after cycle of Clomid, or Femara either. Injectibles always work, unless you're heading for ovarian failure, which you're probably not. The risk of multiples is higher, and it involves both needles and money; other than that, the side effects aren't so bad, unless you're unlucky enough to get ovarian hyperstimulation. It's a good bit pricier than Clomid, but much less expensive than actual IVF. There are lots and lots of good REs in your part of the country -- go find one of them, and see if you might have more options than just Clomid.
Secondary infertility is hard too, and I'm wishing you the best of luck with it all.
Fertility drugs are not a good idea. they cause birth defects such as mine. Clomid. you hate it cuz it made you sick? I learned to hate it because it didn't make me whole.
so yes you want another kid.. but AT WHAT COST? at the cost of them being teased, regardless of how much you love them? my mother loves me. but it didnt stop the tears and teasing.
i would let nature run its course.
its the humane way.
This is a wonderful post. Thanks for writing it.
I have no advice to give because 1) you didn't ask for any, 2) I'm just pregnant for the first time myself, so I have no answers about anything, and 3) I'm really not that smart. But it looks like you have a wonderful family. Good luck with the expansion, however you choose to go about it.
'...and yet because he's enough, more than enough...' YES. Why NOT yearn for more than more? Our hearts can contain multitudes.
Sigh.
So feeling you on this. And wishing you so, so, so much fertile fortune.
Great post Amy!!!
Wow - good luck. Make sure you have the emotional support you need if you take anything that you know will bring you down. Your emotional health is important.
Hey!
I don't think I've ever commented here (shy talking to other moms on the blogosphere), but I had to write after reading your entry.
This has nothing to do with conceiving (though big hugs and good luck with that struggle), but I wondered if you've had a bone density test? I just had one, totally randomly, and have borderline osteoporosis--and I'm 29. I also had a history of anoerexia early in life and thyroid issues. If you haven't, please get yourself checked! It's not too late to start building bone mass if you've got weak bones.
My doctor advised against trying to get pregnant because of the weak bones issue, saying I might 'break a hip' or something ridiculous. I'm getting a second opinion and taking lots of calcium. But the entire experience scared me enough to want to spread the word to other skinny, former eating disordered, coffee and alchohol drinking (bad for bone mass come to find out! Drat..) women.
Hugs! Sorry to post something so entirely random on my first comment.
Anna
Happy Mother's Day!!
And another thing, since you're trying for #2, "Project Babalah" applies again so you are no longer a lazy whore but someone with incredible foresight! ;)
good luck!
Declan is an only and will stay an only, and I feel soooo lucky that my feelings have remained constant on that subject. Not that I have anything against a #2, for you or anyone else, I just feel lucky that I don't have any of the mental masturbation that I am watching so many of my friends go through. And to add complicated fertility issues? Breaks. My. Heart.
Bestest wishes. Make that baby.
I was told that I couldn't have any children without Clomid. (Even though I already had 1...er?) I now have 3. Three. Without Clomid. The second 2 were...um...surprises. Surprises that I love very, very much and couldn't live without, but surprises nonetheless. I personally think the "fertility specialists" have NO IDEA WHAT THE HELL they're talking about.
Many hugs to you, Amy. I know what you're going through.
Um...because I am severely sleep-deprived, and therefore quite stoooopid, I cannot find a way to email you. And I wanted to tell you how much I enjoy "ICANHASCHEESEBURGER." So I'm telling you here, in the comments section.
Thank you. For telling us about it. I go there all the time, and laugh every time.
Hey~
I'm you. Same everything. We tried for three years, I wnt on CLomid, it made me very unhappy. I quit it. I got pregnant. Dude was born Aug 16 '04. We didn't try, but didn't prevent. I figured my body would "get it." It didn't. I went on CLomid again. I cried a lot. I quit it. I am now due around Halloween. I think Clomid works AFTER you quit it. Either that, or we are much more attractive to our husband's when we aren't hot mess crazy. GOod luck. xo
Before I had my daughter, I thought I could be on a Fox show entitled, "When Infertility Attacks!" Then I had her, and I thought, "Oh, goodie, now all of that emotional rollercoaster, 'back-and-forth like a tennis match' thinking I went through when I was childless will be over."
HA!
I completely understand where you are coming from, and all I can say is I will keep your secret prayer ("gimme baby, please") in my thoughts. I'm not quite ready to say that sort of prayer for myself, but I will happily pray it for you.
Happy Mother's Day!
I don't have an amazing comment to match your amazing post, just that I hope it works out for y'all, whatever that looks like and however you get there.
Mmmmmuwhhaaa!
I love children - but. It seems to me that if it's not happening naturally, than maybe the universe is trying to tell you something. Could be any number of things but definitely worth considering, like:
1. Traffic is already pretty heavy. Heh.
2. Perhaps your son needs to be the only one so that he gets all the attention he needs to fulfil his ultimate potential.
3. Greed is insiduous. Let it be. Being present with the changes the child you have now goes through can only be just as fulfilling and joyful as they have been, if you are fully present with him and not fractured off with some other 'new' honeymoon phase.
I think it is very meaningful that Clomid makes you crazy. Listen to your body and honor it. Be grateful. Love ya, mean it, later...
Oh, and I just remembered very important #4:
I've often wondered if all the women who can't have children really have something else that is very important for them to contribute to the world that requires their focus and that's why they can't have children. They aren't -supposed- to have children because they have other gifts that are vital to the planet right now, and they are the ones that must deliver them.
But we all have free will so it's our decision, and it's like the universal balance is trying to encourage us to give other, vital gifts to humanity, or something along those lines.
I know that's a little out there, but that's what has come to me after thinking about it for years.
What a moving post, Amy. I wish you and your family all the luck in the world.
I've heard great things about fertility acupuncture - no chemicals, but if you're a needle-phobe it might be a problem.
Best of luck to you and your family Amy.
And thank you for all of your beautiful words, you brighten my day.
You brought tears to my eyes. Thank you for sharing with us! You deserve a second little bundle of kisses and I hope you can find peace with whatever decision you make.
Hugs!!!!!
well...at least you get to have lots and lots of sex.
(look at me. i can always find a silver lining. especially when i have nothing constructive to say. fertility problems suck. i'd like to give infertility a swift kick for ya. praying for babies)
Delurking just to say this... femara isn't the only option anymore (THANK GOODNESS!). I also went completely crazy on Clomid, so I tried Femara. Not only did I finally ovulate (I NEVER did on even the highest dosages of Clomid), but I didn't get nearly as crazy! No hot flashes, horrible dreams, general crankiness at all. Maybe you should see if Femara is an option for you.
I am annovulatory also. I get a period once every six months or so. I used clomid to try and get pregnant, and got pregnant the month AFTER I stopped taking it. That happens to TONS of people. I now have FOUR boys. My advice... take clomid for only 1 or 2 months...from my experience, one or two months of clomid gets things moving enough to get pregnant when you stop taking it. I understand the fear of taking clomid... it's awful, awful stuff. Hang in there!!
I'm delurking for the first time to tell you - I feel for you!! My first preganacy ended in a miscarriage, and quite by accident I took progesterone to induce AF and I got pregant with my son. He's now 2. I tried the 2nd time for almost a year and became so frustrated I researched on the web and read all kinds of books - pretty much "self-diagnosed myself". I asked for the progesterone again (for a short luteal phase) and I got pregnant. That took 1 year. I'm just now almost 3 months. I wish you much baby luck - BTW, I'm sure you've heard it before, but you son is adorable. I guess you really can't hear that too many times. Happy Mother's Day!
Junglegirl: you forgot #5, which is that "you are broken". Anovulation isn't just some karmic state, or a memo from The Great Beyond. It's a failure of your body to function properly, and has more ramifications than just infertility.
(That's good advice from Anna Evans above, to pay attention to bone density, because anovulation -> chronic low estrogen -> bone loss. When you rarely or never ovulate, you're in a state that's hormonally pretty similar to menopause, and you have to pay attention to these things.)
Sorry, but the it-wasn't-meant-to-be argument just bugs me, when there's an obvious physical issue that can relatively easily be corrected. The same physical problem that makes me infertile also screwed up my thyroid, but nobody thinks that hypothyroidism is God's way of telling me to slow down and take lots of naps. I think I'd have an easier time with the God's-will take on infertility if I could actually, y'know, even have periods like a normal person.
Even though I am fortunate enough to be a mother after infertility, I still have a lot of anger at my body for not working right in the first place. Not that I think you could tell or anything.
I feel assy giving you advice because it's such a personal issue about your lady business, buuut, I read one comment about not imposing time limits on yourself. Sounded like some good advice.
Hoping for the best. Happy mama's day.
P.S. "Lady Business" is the best all-girl band name EVER.
I took Clomid to get pg with my first. (Didn't need it after that - how strange - annovulatory before then - don't know what happened.)It was hell. Pure, absolute hell. (I also took Provera with it.) But it worked, and she is 6 years old now and making me crazy. Her brother the same age as Noah - further apart than I wanted, for other reasons beyond my control. And I would and wouldn't do it again (take the Clomid, that is), if need be. I think I am done, but I wouldn't have wanted my daughter to miss out on a sibling, not for anything. And I wouldn't have wanted to miss out on another baby, on more love, on watching him learn, and grow, and be absolutely gorgeous and cute and funny. These kids are my everything, and they are so worth it. Good luck to you.
Clomid is the worst. I hated it and, for me, it didn't work. Then again, I have PCOS and needed the big Gonal-F guns. Whatever you choose to do, good luck. We're all here to serve as nice, little, loyal punching bags when you need it.
As for the having a second baby, I have a different perspective: I have twins. I'm also the girl who couldn't keep a plant alive, let alone a kid...or two. But, you figure it all out, and the stress wanes a bit, and you become this criminally happy family despite how much work it is.
Good luck and keep us all posted!
I am in your position exactly. I love my son with all my heart and if it turns out that the FET we are gearing up for fails, I will be all happy and squishy with love for my little boy.
ButheissowonderfulandIwouldlovetohaveanotherandandandand...
*sigh*
I hope your Mother's Day was wonderful.
(I am very intentionally not saying anything stupid about your very personal dilemna, because I don't know what would sound stupid and what would sound poignant. But that right there was me telling you that I'm listening to you and I'm hearing you.)
Xx
I think, Emma, what I was trying to propose is the thought that maybe there is more going on than merely the physical and it might be helpful in the decision making process to consider that. Now that we have the technology to 'fix' nearly any 'breakdown', I think it is helpful to look at the holistic connections in order to help make difficult decisions. It always helps me, anyway.
The planet is overpopulated, and it only stands to reason that women have a lot to offer the world beyond babies. We need to make the time to consider what our role is in the world now that the mission of 'be fruitful and multiply' is quite accomplished. I'd also like to think we can discuss options intellectually in a non-snarky way in order to help find peace of mind and a fulfilling resolution to the problem.
And hey, if another child is the choice, I did notice in an earlier post that her son is waving a turkey baster around like a majic wand - isn't that some long-forgotten, natural method of encouraging things along?
So I know you aren't going to read comment 1,564 but I am going to share anyway. Hubby and I have been ttc for the past few months. So far no luck. Will was a surprise - we had no plans to have a baby at that time. Now I can't imagine life without him. And that little voice is nagging in the back of my head. How do you make it through every day without going crazy? I don't want to obsess over this but it seems to be all consuming and I do not want to be one of "those people."
My husband & I have been trying for about 9 months with no luck. I am trying to "just relax" (and how about that being the most helpful assvice EVER) but I am pretty much a reproductive dinosaur (34) & we just moved to a new state & I don't have a new job yet, which means no health insurance, which means we're not exactly in a position to go to a reproductive specialist, & hey, did I mention my sister-in-law has 5 kids & is considering getting pregnant again which she can do INSTANTLY, I think she is the most fertile woman on the planet & if she says ONE MORE TIME that we'd better hurry up & "start trying" because I'm not getting any younger, I think I may kill someone . . .
Ahem.
Thanks for letting us in on your feelings & frustration both before you had Noah & now. I may be crazy, but at least I have company. :-)
I am sure you have heard it all- so I won;t bother you with much - just this...
hugs and support coming your way what ever you choose!
And you made me cry - again.
I am sure you have heard it all- so I won;t bother you with much - just this...
hugs and support coming your way what ever you choose!
And you made me cry - again.
I see that a few commenters have already suggested acupuncture, and I have to say that it's worth a try. I started going for treatment for an entirely different health reason, but I ended up getting pregnant. My husband and I had been trying to conceive for over 2 years. It was a pretty awesome side effect! My acupuncurist (in MA) claims to have a 79% success rate in fertility treatment.
So, anyway, that's my two cents. Oh, and the needles don't hurt. Good luck!
No ass-vice. but did want to say haveing siblings makes my life complete in many ways. There have been many times when i've been sad depressed etc and it's been things i just couldn't talk to my parent about. My brothers though have always been amazing. they are often my rock in hard times.
Good luck with whatever you choose to do.
Ok, Amalah. Here is MY 2 cents (like you really asked for it). I started reading your blog while you were on Clomid, depressed, and childless. You were very entertaining, actually. I kept reading, delurking every once and a while. While I wasn't trying to get pregnant as long as you were, nor was I on medication at the time, I felt akin with your story. I followed it. We got pregnant at the same time. Noah is 1 month younger than my daughter. Every emotion that you felt during the pregnancy, I was shouting, "yeah sister". When I couldn't handle breastfeeding or working full time with a newborn, you were going through the same thing. As I am living pretty far away from friends and family, I felt far away from them, but your internet nuggets were right here, where I live, and I had more of an instant connection. NO I am not a stalker. What I will tell you is that I got pregnant again while my daughter was 10 months old. It was not planned. And omg, being pregnant with a toddler was really hard. You weren't pregnant with me this time. I felt as if no one understood how hard it was. My "support" was gone. Now, here is my advice. Enjoy your time with Noah now. Relish in all the cool stuff he says and does before adding another love of your life to the mix. And find another GREAT sitter. while I wouldn't trade either daughter for the world, I feel as if my oldest didn't get enough Mom-time. And good luck for number 2. I will pray for you.
I'm sure that someone's mentioned this, and I don't recall you asking for advice, but I'm gonna give it anyway! I had a stillbirth in Jan '05, and then 3 miscarriages after that. I'm currently 27 weeks pregnant, and believe that it entirely has to do with me getting my body in line by going to a naturopath. A On a forum that I go to, where lots of the ladies have struggled with infertility, they swear by Traditional Chinese Medicine and accupuncture. I didn't do the TCM or the accupuncture, but did do the holistic approach to complete physical health. It's just a thought!
Wishing you many blessings and your heart's desires as you travel down this road.
I honestly don't think I can contribute any more than what everyone else has said. But I say, acupuncture and, perhaps, get thee to an RE (sorry, assvice alert). There are new advances all the time (so I'm told) so perhaps there is an alternative to good ol' blechy clomid.
Yes, yes -- what Ali said. Try acupuncture. It'll relax you. And the peeps who administer it (get an authentic Chinese doctor) are very wise about fertility, etc. It's worth a try before resorting to Clomid again.
I have only one comment. You got a WONDERFUL, ANGELIC kid the first time around. You are DUE for a demonic terror. I'm just sayin. That's the way the Universe rolls.
But hey, good luck anyway! (Wink, wink, nudge, nudge) ;)
Absolutely no assvice whatsoever from me. Just wanted to wish you the best of luck and say that I totally get that loving the one child you have makes you want to have another one so much more. I mean, if you have so much love now, imagine what it would be like times two? :-)
Beautiful, just beautiful.
Good luck!