I lurk, but now I am number one.

I am also not very religious, and I don't want to give assvice so I think it might be best if I stay out of this one.

I am also mostly a lurker, but I just wanted to say that I really liked this post--and it made me think also about religion, although I don't have any good answers!

The whole time I was reading this in my head I was all "me too, me too" I think one of the reasons is that I live in the South where religion is very much a part of politics and you can hardly find a church that isn't - church + religious right = going to heaven. We attend church every Sunday but I always find myself yearning for the faith I used to feel.

great post Amalah. I love the posts about the fucking zoo and high heels and the advice smackdown, but these types of posts always remind me how raw and honest and powerful your writing can be.

I'm in the same boat as you in terms of religious background, and every time I go home to see my family I'm faced with these same kinds of issues... and I become even more firmly convinced that there is no one easy answer, but the fact that we're at least thinking about it is a good thing.

anyway, not trying to send assvice or anything, just a sincere thank you for a thought-provoking post.

WOW! is all I can say! That was an awesome post and really got me thinking also! thanks!

Thanks for making me think.

Great post. I love reading your thoughts.

If it makes you feel better... at our church? We wear jeans and such. We dressed up for our daughter's baby dedication, but that's about it. We're a come as you are church. I mean, if Jesus ate with prostitutes and tax collectors, I'm sure he wouldn't mind my jeans (and sometimes flip flops! *gasp*) ;)

This is beautiful.

I was raised Baptist but switched to the Episcopal Church in college. Though that's not to say I attend church. I don't. I thought about going last Sunday, Pentecost Sunday, but then my friends and I decided to eat a late breakfast at the Pancake House instead.

The way I see it, I don't have to have anything figured out until I have kids who are old enough to know what church is all about, or at least understand the concept of church. You've still got time.

Great post, Amalah. That young man's behavior is an example of what I wish the Bible inspired more people to be.

The black/white, right/wrong, Heaven/Hell dichotomies fade in the light of goodness, lovingkindness, compassion and openheartedness to ALL others. I truly believe that is what Jesus was trying to teach ... Love for everyone. Decency for everyone. Salvation, however you choose to define it, for EVERYONE. I don't pretend to understand it, but I believe it is true and I don't think you ever have to darken the door of a church even once in your life to know it.

I, for one, have never been closer to God than in my own home while holding my sweet sleeping baby in my arms ... It looks like He makes appearances at Chipotle during lunchtime, too! Amen!

I think Melissa and I go to the same church! I look out into the congregation on any given Sunday and see people dressed in jeans, t-shirts, yoga gear, and ballet tutus. The fact that I don't have to put on my "Sunday best" in order to go is one of the great things about my particular church.

I love this post. Thanks so much for your honesty. It's refreshing.

I was raised in an uber-conservative church of Christ. This means women were not allowed to hold leadership positions and that we sang acapella. And it took me a helluva long time to be willing to go to church again after high school. And now? Somehow I like it again. Oh, some days I admit that I don't really know if I believe this stuff. And then I realize this is what that guy in the Bible meant when he said to Jesus, "I believe. Help thou my unbelief."

I wonder if you know how much you've spoken to me today.

It isn't about church- or religion. Church is like a club for people who believe the same thing- a place to hang out with friends, family or strangers who are all interested in learning more about a common interest.

The faith issue is one of your own heart- to sound trite & overquoted- a "relationship" with God.

It's very easy for the world to bash God, or Jesus. It's also very easy for churchy-people to bash those they decide aren't like them.

I know my relationship with God gives me hope when I don't have it, peace when I can't find it, and patience when it isn't humanly possible to have any. Similar to my relationship with my hubby, or my dad, only bigger and without human error on His side.

Good people exist without God, yes they do. Love exists without God, and so does obedience and kindness.

I'm not into the Bible-thumping, fire & brimstone approach. You have to go with what's in your heart, Amy. It sounds like you know what its all about, down deep.

I too struggle with the guilt, of oh crud, what if I don't tell so-and-so about God, and they burn in hell and its my fault. What if I miss the opportunity to be a witness because I'm fussing at my daughter for flirting with a total stranger in the Target?

But to me, I do the best I can, as much as I can, to show love and do what the Bible says. The rest is up to God, and He works through me despite my stupid human errors.

I'm not (even though I know I'll probably be slammed for this) going to say that it isn't important, or reduce the significance of submission to God to anything other than what it is- necessary in order to avoid hell, necessary in order to find true joy and peace and happiness outside of selfish pleasure.

Its also a huge privilege to me that God even wants to have anything to do with me, me with my procrastinating, my fascination with sugar free cookies, my attitude problems once a month ha ha.

Best wishes to you. Quite a quandary you have here, but I know you can sort it out.

I've been a lurker and occasional commenter for years. I have to say that this post may be one of my favorites of all time. I love your honesty. Faith, just like life, is a journey. None of us have it all together. Nobody has all the answers. And most certainly nobody is perfect. There was only one perfect person and things didn't turn out all that great for Him.

I am not going to give you any advice or tell you what I think you need to do, but as a Christian I will say that there are less judgemental ones of us out there. After reading the post where you went into your church background it seems that the church you grew up in was very rules oriented. And also not so forgiving. And if you feel like you should, explore options that might fit you better.

awesome.

After being educated in the North, and learning about all the dozens of powerful religions more ancient than my own Christianity, I found it difficult to recover my Southern faith. Because my brain refused to accept what I'd been taught there as fact any longer.

After years of self-investigation, however, I'm so glad I lost that faith. The one on one relationship I have now with 'god' (who is not the Jesus or god I was raised to believe in) is so much more powerful. I take my kids to church to learn values and to be a part of my southern community. But it's when I'm IN church that I feel like a fraud.

There are times I feel closer to god eating a burrito and drinking a beer than singing Methodist songs with the electric guitar. Morals and ehtics are good things, but believing in the validity of one religion over another kind of creeps me out at this point in my life. All people are worthy of love and redemption, even those who have never heard the word 'Jesus' or 'Allah'. And some of the best, sweetest people I've known have never seen the inside of a church, but I know they live daily in the real kingdom of heaven.

Off soap box,

A

I am floundering in my faith right now. This post makes me realize how much I miss all of those things that I shared with my children. I literally got goose bumps reading this post. Thank you.

Beautiful post. I was raised Catholic, but my parents pulled us out of the church before I made my confirmation. My husband was raised Southern Baptist and nearly became a pastor.

We're torn. We don't have any children yet, but plan to have one sometime soon?! Do we take our kids to church to give them structure and comfort, and an identity in our religious community? Even though we don't have faith in what is being preached?

Is teaching your kid to do the right thing because it's the right thing, and not endorsing any kind of religion setting them up for trouble later? Should we give them that foundation and let them choose to reject it when/if they are ready and capable?

Do we *really* not have that faith in our hearts? Is that because we've had bad experiences with the church? Is it because we've become jaded and bitter? Could it be that we're avoiding some self examination by avoiding religion?

Or is it what we tell people, and each other- that no one can have the right answer and if we had been born and raised in Iran we wouldn't be eating pork and would be worshipping Allah instead of God? That no one can know or understand God because he, she, it is just too big and complex to be tied down and fleshed out in one or several "divine" texts?

Awesome post.

First of all - amazing entry. Seriously. I've been there with a lot of the same thoughts. If you find the answers, let me know.

i felt myself getting teary reading this. i don't know if it's pms or if it's because i've been avoiding dealing with the same frustrations and uncertainty. i was brought up in a very religious family, sent to private christian school k-12, yada yada yada. but these days i can't seem to pray even when i try (which isn't very often). i didn't even go to church on christmas. i think i've just become so disillusioned with the whole organized religion thing that it's frustrating and hard to know what's true and what's bullshit.

Thank you for this Amy. I'm going through something very similar. My 4 year old daughter is named Grace and yet she has never been to church other than her baptism. I find myself struggling with my lack of faith recently and what it all means.

Amy,

Just a great post. It obviously speaks to a lot of people, including myself. Thanks for sharing with us.

Probably your best post.

Seek the answers to those wonderings.

Seek the love that guy showed you and the family that sat with him.

THAT is the love of Christ. Being real. Giving to others - even if it's just helping a mom with a high-chair or sharing a too-large table in a crowded restaurant. Not being ashamed of the Faith that sustains you. Not being ashamed of something very private and very politically incorrect.

He was an example for all us Christians. and non-Christians. Matthew 22:37-39

Thanks for this post.

Wow Amy! No one writes these kind of posts like you.

And even thought I'm Jewish, I can so relate to everything you said.

I think it's a really hard topic. I am somewhat (okay, probably very) religious, but I think that a lot of times people find themselves further and further from an organized religion simply because the faith of their childhood is insufficient to meet the needs of adulthood. How can the kind of system that caused you guilt for the "heathen" children fit your post-modern, inclusive worldview? If you really want to explore (and only you and Jason really know if you do), I would encourage you to do so. There are a lot of wonderful faith communities out there now that are a far cry from the evangelicalism of our childhoods.

I actually returned to the church I grew up in after a period of several years. Not because my beliefs had returned ot what they were as a child (very similar to yours). But because I needed a support system. I needed my family. I don't believe it is our responsibility to save souls, who do we think we are? I don't believe in creation. I am not even sure I believe in hell. I believe in following the teachings of Christ. The compassion, the mercy, the tolerance. Everything else gets washed away. So sometimes I don't agree with my church family. But I smile to myself and love them anyway. They have taken such good care of me and my family. Thanks for telling us where you saw God on Sunday...he does not confine himself to a church building. :)

i have to post now, and i never have before, because it just so happens that i had a little crisis of faith of my own this weekend. i was at a wedding, not a chipotle, but they are equally religious experiences according to some (though i'll be honest my preference by a landslide is for baja fresh) (and oh man was that a sacreligious thing i just said!).

anyway, i've been having some sort of a quarter life crisis (or whatever you want to call it), mostly related to my job and wondering if it is my career, if i'm a "lifer" where i am now, and if i should make a move... and i took a personality/job assessment recently which told me to consider becoming clergy. usually i wouldn't trust those things, or i'd at least take them not-too-seriously, but something really hit me about that, it suddenly seemed to make a lot of sense to me. and then at this wedding i thought, WOW i love weddings, it would be such a treat to get to marry people.

yet i can't even begin to imagine the journey back to that lifestyle when it seems like it's so far away from me today...

it's actually nice to hear that other people think about that, too.

Sincere kindness is the most authentic and effective form of evangelism.

Lurker here. I loved this post so here I am, out of the shadows. I have to admit I expected you to wrap this one up with some sort of sarcastic remark about religion of something of the sort. I don't mean that in a judgemental way, but just because of some things I've read here in the past. Funny how little actions like that can really make you think. The cool thing is that maybe some days you (or I or whoever) do little nice things and it affects someone else's thinking. Don't really know what my point is, but loved the post. Got me thinking.....

I am Jewish but don't go to Temple. (BTW, my mom called my college roommate Amy, Amalah.) My husband is Polish National Catholic but he doesn't go to church. We have two kids and they are getting along just fine. They have good manners, morals, respect, etc.

A Christian friend and her 2 kids are staying with my family right now. Her 6 year old told me that I wasn't going to go to God because I don't go to church.

I was so offended but bit my tongue. How dare he tell me that I have to go to a building to pray and gain entrance to Heaven. I don't think his religious teachers could teach him to be a bit more open minded. Religion is not so cut and dry.

Wow. Great post, Amy. I don't have much to say, it just seems like one of those moments where words don't mean much. But I don't think it has to be all or nothing.

Please don't think I'm an assvice giving asshole, but please check out the UCC (United Church of Christ) Church of Obama and Oprah, where I think you might find that your common sense and politics might jibe with your faith.

I love your observations... and how you show what's in your heart...

Kindness of strangers = God
Love = God

Just my 2 cents... from a spiritually curious, non-religious reader ...

This is really a beautiful post.

Two things come to mind....first is a song verse: "I'll be a witness in the silences when words are not enough".

And a bible verse: "Therefore by their fruits you will know them". Matthew 7:16-20

He was a silent witness, and I think that is so absolutely beautiful!

Amen Amy.

What an amazing post. I too have lost faith and couldn't have related more. Being the daughter of a Church Secretary and also a Mom of two children who aren't baptized has definately caused a few waves in my family.

The line is so fine. I admire people who have strong faith but could be more turned off by those who get all preachy, preachy. Someday I hope to find a nice happy medium.

Thanks for putting out there what I've been thinking for so long. Funny that the faith that's supposed to provide "peace that passes all understanding" can also cause so much confusion. You'll work it out.

Another gal de-lurking for a moment.
Just wanted to also thank you for being honest about your experience.
To think- you'd see Jesus at Chipotle!

I have other thoughts on this subject...but basically I'm just sorry that you had a bad experience with the church of your childhood.

It sounds so cliche...but keep seeking. You'll find Him.

You're good, Storch. Been too long since I've told you so. You are really, really good. And that's coming from a JEW! So...

I am Jewish, hubby is Southern Baptist. Our home reeks of brimstone. We are both churchless heathens and quite happy to be that way. Hubby was ruined by the Baptists and I still suffer under the thumb of a Jewish Mother.
Religion is such a personal thing, only you know where you belong. Great post!

In the world today, when we have the choice of bringing up our children in church or not, there really isn't a choice. I too was raised going to church every sunday and as a young college student and adult feel out of the "habit". When my children came along I was determined that they be raised in church because I knew I could never "train them up in the way they should go" without help from others. They are both in their early twenties now and use their musical talents often by singing in church services and working in Youth retreats. I'm proud and I'm humbled and I'm thankful that they know Jesus and we don't ever have to be permanently separated. Satan works very hard to keep us apart from Christ - I backslide from church, and when I go back to praying regular and attending regular my life smooths back out - why do I keep sliding back? My advice you didn't ask for is, raise your child in a church environment. Don't try to find one that doesn't have political/personality problems - there isn't one because its filled with humans who are flawed. Being in church is better all around than not being in church. Your post really brightened my day.

Beautiful post. One of my favorites so far. I won't go into my story, but it's so similar. And I ended up going back to church once my second child came along. But this time I found a church that didn't insist I save everyone or even believe a particular thing. I go to this church because I can be exactly who I am when I'm there and that is such a huge relief.

If you haven't read the book "Eat, Pray, Love" I think you would really enjoy it. Especially the part that talks about the notion that "God lives in you, AS you". That makes so much sense to me. Why else would we all be so different?

I'm delurking to say awesome post! Thanks for sharing.

That was a great post Amy, yet again. You're a very talented writer and it especially shows when you share something close to your heart like this. Thank you :-)
I am a Christian, and I try very hard not to be judgmental because I think that's just as wrong as anything for which people judge others.
I hope you find your faith, and a church family you can live with. You'll never find a perfect one, of course, but I hope you find one that is good and honest and genuinely full of love.
Bless you :-)

First time posting; I would like to echo some of the others about being saddened for your unhappy religious experience early on. What you witnessed at Chipotle was the Great Commandment, but you already know that. God is pure love, period, and I'm a devout, happy Catholic whose faith has sustained her over these 44 years. Everybody's spiritual path is different, Mother Theresa used to say, and you are one heck of an amazing wonderful person, and a great mom, I might add. Keep on searching and questioning and looking. Read the beautiful book Once Upon a Tandem (non-denominational Christian -- very short, lots of great woodcut prints). I will send you a copy if I can get an address.
Keep up the great work!

See, that's the thing. It's not whether you go to church or not that makes you a Christian, (although, it's an important part of faith..I believe you have to find the *right* church) it's how you live your life. Do people see Christ in you? Do you do for others? Do you help people in need who are carrying a high-chair and a toddler in a crowded retraurant, or do you watch, hoping that they won't come your way and knock you in the ankles?

I always laugh when I hear the statement, "being in a garage doesn't make you a car, just like being in church doesn't necessarily make you a Christian". But it rings true.

God speaks to us in many ways...I'm glad that you saw him in that man. Maybe he's knocking on your heart and asking you to check him out again?

((hugs!!))

I wonder how many people see me on Sunday, running my errands while dressed in yoga pants and flip flops, and assume that I am a Godless heathen. I am very active in my church, and serve as a Eucharistic Minister, but almost always attend Mass on Saturday night. Appearances can be very deceiving, and faith is not limited to one day a week.

Faith is too personal for anyone to tell you how to have it. if you find a religion and a church that fills a need for you, that's wonderful. If you don't, you can still teach your children what they need to know about love and compassion and generosity to those who need help.

Delurking to say wow, what a great post. I can relate.

I did not take the time to read the other 90-some comments, I apologize if I am repeating what others have said. I do not think you need to be in church to find God or revisit the faith of your youth. Church is a place. Relationship with Christ and Faith is seperate from the place.Can the place help you grow? Sure. Is it REQUIRED for growth? No. I get a kick out of your blog, your sarcasm entertains me. I am a person of faith (technically with a title "missionary to Haiti") who hardly finds it my place to judge you --- and I skip church all the time. Cool story and a great reminder to all of us to treat others well, you never know how a small gesture of kindness will impact someone.

Someone once told me that being a Christian is like sitting on a three-legged stool... one leg is going to church, one leg is reading your bible and the third leg is fellowship with others. If you're missing a leg, the stool falls over.

That just stuck with me and I thought I'd pass it on.

Like you, I grew up in a strict religious home (Mormon), lost my faith some time around the same time I moved out of my parents' home, and have a son with an Old Testament name.

I've gone to church sporadically over the years but never found one I was completely comfortable with. I do believe in God, I just don't think I need a minister to run interference for me with Him.

Now that My Kid is a teenager, he's started going to a Wednesday Youth church group. He started going b/c all his friends go there, but I have to think he's getting some good out of it. (Luckily, it's at one of those new fangled casually dressed, liberal churches that doesn't cram a lot of dogma down your throat.) I'm happy about it b/c I feel like it's a decision he's making for himself, rather than something he's been forced into by his parents.

Of course, I live in the south. There's a church on every corner in this city and, in the short bio for Mr. & Miss Public High School in the yearbook, it lists what church they're members of. So it's almost impossible NOT to get caught up with a group of church kids. Your son may not have that same experience where you are.